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Elder Scrolls Central Forums  |  Emma's TES Forum - Hosted by ESCF  |  Emma's Index  |  WIPs and Beta testing (Moderators: Tim, Emma)  |  Topic: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Zylox
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Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« on: Jan 26, 2006, 09:52 pm »

So far my adoption mod works fine, with two exceptions. The first problem is with the PositionCell command which I asked about in another thread. The second problem is with getting the child to walk up or down the stairs in follow mode while in Rethan Manor(Hlaalu stronghold).

Most of the time the npc starts walking back and forth at the bottom of the stairs, as if her path was blocked. Some of the time she will walk up the stairs, but coming down the steps she will stop just above the bottom step and walk back and forth again. If she is in wander mode, she will walk up to the problem spots and then stop as if she had run into a wall.

I was wondering if this is a common problem for companions in Rethan Manor? If not, I will start looking at my scripts, but I don't think that there is anything in them that should cause this sort of problem.
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Emma
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Re: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #1 on: Jan 26, 2006, 11:43 pm »

I don't know about Rethan Manor, but a wild guess would be that it's her size. Compared to 'normal' npcs she is scaled down to 70 % or something like that. This has side effects. A so much downscaled npc will have a difficulty with both x- y- and z- movements. For instance, I have seen a down-scaled little woodelf (not from children mod) who walked in concrete up to her hips when going over the Balmora Bridges.

As for the small children, i have see them walk right through certain static objects.

I think your problem is connected to this and you may have to live with it unless you make her a teenager instead.

It could of course also be a problem with Rethan Manor - have you checked how the pathgrids look for that stair?
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Zylox
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Re: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #2 on: Jan 27, 2006, 01:12 am »

Now it's time to show my ignorance BigGrin How do you check the path grids?

As far as the character moving through solid objects, I found that out when I tried to make her climb onto a bed. I think that I have a work around for that, but if it does not work, I may have to alter my plans for having her use the sleep animation.
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Re: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #3 on: Jan 27, 2006, 02:48 am »

In the icons list at the upper left corner in tESCS, you'll find the pathgrid button between teh landscape  button and the light button, it's yellow lines and red dots (sorry, have no better words for it)
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Pathgridding for dummies
« Reply #4 on: Jan 27, 2006, 06:51 am »

Alright, this time Emma won't steal my thunder while I'm making pics and uploading them.  wink

Pathgridding for dummies

<> A. Click on the Pathgrid icon or use World->Edit Cell Path Grid.


<> B. This will bring up a small window. Generate default grid isn't interesting, as it will make the same mistakes as the AI. Granularity defines the size of the squares created by the red path nodes (red == default) when a default path grid is generated. Save user points seems to have no purpose, user points are always saved anyway. You can check it just to be sure.


<> C. So, leave the path grid window open, and go to your render window.


Here are the rules of making pathgrids:
1. Path nodes can be selected and moved just like any other items.
2. However, they can't be rotated. (That would be useless anyway.) A right click creates a new path node.
3. Default path nodes are red, custom path nodes are blue. Moving a red node turns it to blue.
4. Path nodes can be deleted just like items, with the delete key.
5. In this mode, it's the selected node that is used as the pivot point when rotating/centering/etc. the view.
6. With a node selected, Ctrl + left click on another connects both; or if they're already connected, disconnects them.
7. Pathways and pathnodes are especially useful at places where the AI has trouble navigating. A flat, large, straight hallway without obstacles won't even need one, but a place with stairs, doorjambs, ramps, and other obstacles will need a detailed grid.

A good example is the famous cavern of Addamasartus, near Seyda Neen:

As you see, the grid follows the ledge leading to the entrance. If you delete this in a test esp, then start a new game with that esp, you'll notice that the smuggler in the first piece won't react adequately. Attack her from the entrance with ranged weapons, and she'll charge straight at you and get stuck in the elevation. With the path grid, she knows that to reach the entrance she has to pass through the ledge.

<> D. Finally, once you've made the path grid for your cell, click on Save. This saves your pathgrid and closes the path grid window, returning the render window to its usual mode.
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Re: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #5 on: Jan 27, 2006, 08:08 am »

Gez, this is an absolutely excellent mini-tutorial on path-grids! It really should have it's own topic, too!

If you would care to post it also as a stand-alone topic, it would be absolutely great.

Also, with your permission, I would like to add the thread also to my tutorials section on my site, because I think many people will find it very useful.
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Zylox
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Re: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #6 on: Jan 27, 2006, 11:46 am »

Wow Gez, that was great information notworthy

Thanks to both of you for the help. Emma, I think it would be great to make this into part of a tutorial.
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Re : Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #7 on: Jan 27, 2006, 08:36 pm »

Gez, this is an absolutely excellent mini-tutorial on path-grids! It really should have it's own topic, too!

If you would care to post it also as a stand-alone topic, it would be absolutely great.

Also, with your permission, I would like to add the thread also to my tutorials section on my site, because I think many people will find it very useful.

I also posted it here on the TR boards.

And you have full permission to do what you want with this mini tut. grin
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Re: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #8 on: Jan 27, 2006, 09:01 pm »

Wow.

Thanks for this thead, everyone. Now I should be able to make my house mod more friendly to companions! (for the most part they get around things fine, there's just a couple spots that they seem to have trouble with)
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Re: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #9 on: Jan 28, 2006, 03:19 am »

GEZ, thank you! grin. Even if it's on TR boards (which has an excellent tutorial section - I'm linking to it from my site) it's always good to have a tutorial on more than one place, should a site be down for a day or two. So, I'll put this mini tutorial in my little tutorial section.
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Re: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #10 on: Jan 28, 2006, 10:18 pm »

I wanted to let everyone know how it has turned out. There are already path-grids in Rethan Manor, but they did not work properly. After experimenting, I found that the problem areas had the path-grid elevated a fair distance above the stairs, and that by lowering the path-grid so that it was just barely going through the edge of the steps, it worked properly. However, path-grids were not able to fix all of the problems. My companion could go up the stairs fine, but she was unable to go through the doorway at the bottom of the stairs when going down the stairs, so I removed the doorjam and everything works fine now.  cifriday

I would guess that if there are multiple obstructions, a path-grid may not be adequate to take care of the problem.
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Over there. That's new.


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Re: Trouble with companion on stairs in Rethan Manor
« Reply #11 on: Jan 29, 2006, 01:49 am »

In the icons list at the upper left corner in tESCS, you'll find the pathgrid button between teh landscape button and the light button, it's yellow lines and red dots (sorry, have no better words for it)

Personally, I love the in-game console command TPG, if I find people aren't following me nicely, I incant that and.. "Bah! there's no grid here! Lazy modders!"

-Neko BigGrin
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